absurdity | i think this belongs here...

keen-o!

heh....whoah.....deeep

uhh... apoc, what's your sig supposed to say?

Whoa...apoc is posting...

But isn't the chaos spilling over to our 'organized' world? All the conflicts, disasters... The balance forces it's way through. And on the other hand, all things are the way they should be. If they were some other way, it wouldn't be this world, or this moment, would it now?

Complete order is alien to nature, and still things are in their natural order. This'd propose that 'order' isn't what we first think of it, everything neatly and cleanly regulated, but rather a certain set of principles by which things work and exist.

well, how stable is this order?

what would it take to distrupt it, or at the very least make everyone more aware of how odd it seems at times?

In my opinion, everything that happens and exists here, is nature, and therefor natural, and thus this 'natural order' cannot be broken. Everything is included in it.

well, i can't argue with that, no matter how nihilistic some people might find that concept.

do you think that all of our so-called "advances" related to "human civilization" are an attempt to defeat the cold, uncaring reality that wild animals have to live with on a dialy basis?

i mean, we both have to kill to survive. i don't care who you are on this planet, you're living because something else died. (yikes, this is all starting to sound oddly biblical, isn't it? hmm... pray to the meat / plants on your plate, not jesus...) but of course, we have removed ourselves from murder by many steps.

hmm. here's a thought... would the human-on-human murder rate increase if every person on this planet had to go out and kill their food every day, or do you think we'd all gain a greater respect for death, and stop killing eachother so often?

The human on human murder rate would stay the same no matter what, if you ask me. And besides you can't generalize this...Some cultures do have a respect for death, as you call it, and others don't. You could look at it this way: compare the concept of death and killing in Japan or an African country. It's all about the culture. I fail to see the connection between the human-to-human murder rate and going out to kill for food every day though...

i just think that people would start thinking of murder in a different light. more of a way of a way to harvest food for eating, and a last-ditch way to end disputes, rather than seeing it as the only way to solve them.

Quote: from JuggleFoe on 12:20 am on June 18, 2001
do you think that all of our so-called "advances" related to "human civilization" are an attempt to defeat the cold, uncaring reality that wild animals have to live with on a dialy basis?

No, I rather think of them as complex 'sticks' if you get my meaning. The chimps use sticks to dig for ants, we use our tools to improve our gains. I fail to see the point where materials from nature, that are crafted by something from nature, become unnatural. Our cities are comparable to insect hives. Many individuals working for common good. And our buildings are little more than nests, like the birds create by their own 'hand'. We have just advanced the building process thanks to our mental abilities.

And how do you know that our 'counciousness' isn't just our instincts? Maybe all the other animals have the same level, but aren't nearly as smart.

And I agree with Amor. But undergoing a cultural change probably would alter the way people see death and killing. It might not be seen as something horrible anymore. Or then again,  it could cause ultimate panic and horror.

My opinion about murder is pretty simple. If it's done to gain power (or something else my ethics and morals deem worthy) I can accept it. I rather non-violent methods though. And even violence should be subtle and covered, so that it would seem irrelevant towards the reason it was done for, rather an 'accident' or something, instead of all out shoot out, like the one in Nepal (see other topic for my opinions about this).

Violence is for those who lack intelligence and subtelty and should only be used as a last resort. Period.

i entirely agree with that last statement.

Ditto! Violence, physical violence, makes me sick to my stomach. Literally. I'd avoid it anyway I could.

apoc's sig seems to read "Death to false metal".

Anyway: you're right about the art student/character development thing.  Character development isn't a necessarily good or bad thing: it's a property.  Just like salt (again with the comparisons, more on that later) it can be used sparingly or excessively.  I can use "the lack of character development" as an explanation for me not liking a movie, but another movie might have just as little character development but be incredibly enjoyable.

Comparison is used as a coping mechanism by humanity at all levels.  I react to a stimulus differently than, say, neph or foe because I have different previous experiences against which to compare and contrast the shared stimuli.  The sight of a dead body doesn't phase neph one bit, as it seems a perfectly normal thing in comparison to his experiences at his old job, while I'm more likely to have a far more visceral reaction, as I have no previous experience with dead bodies against which to compare the one in front of me.

Okay, that was poorly planned, thought out, and written.  Me tired.  Blegh.

no, that was coherent enough. i got your flow.